Rebel Earth No?

[Quaddy]

...Mia and Laras are a really, really ridiculously dysfunctional couple, aren't they? Like...Lifetime special dysfunctional...

Poor Mia.

OK, poor Laras, too...I think these two need to have a proper sit down. Mia can explain to Laras why she feels like her world is crumbling around her and Laras can explain the same. And they can stop fightfucking.

[Quaddy]

Just re-read it (yeah, shut up) and I realized something...

Mia and Laras are far too similar for their own good. And where they're different is only making things worse. 'Cause they're reacting to being holed up in this enclave in their own respective ways, which only serves to infuriate the other. Mia is reaching out for emotional support from the one person she trusts completely and Laras...is being Laras (and probably doesn't particularly approve of Mia trusting him completely).

What I can't tell is whether he's purposely holding himself back or he really does think she's being needy by wanting to be involved in some way?

[Quaddy]

Hey Zeph...just to let you know that Rebel gets precedence over any of my other campfires, so whatever else of mine you're in...you can do this one first...

Tada gets to Blarney right at the end of your addition this round! YAY TADA! (Mia is so going to need him...)

[Zephyr Shenkiken]

Lol I know Quaddy. It's handled. Don't worry about Rebel, one way or another this one'll get done.

[Matt]

I think Laras is seriously trying - which is a massive thing for him. So I think the fact that she's not seeing it is kinda cutting him more than any of the rumours etc. Plus I think he's getting as close as he can to a declaration for her but he's still his father's son and whilst I don't think he 'needs' her as some think, I think he takes it very seriously that he said they'd fight together 'spiritually' even if not literally side-by-side.

Unfortunately, they're both stubborn and she's not going to like hearing about other people's opinions of her any more than he does. So yeah... he's thinks he's trying, she thinks she's trying... Don't you think it'll be more interesting this way? Especially because now we can play with the idea that some people are sympathetic on both sides rather than just portraying Laras like some kind of broken action man. I mean... if he was a broken action man then would they even have him on the committee? I doubt it.

I also thought it was time that we remember that Laras isn't just an angry man with issues, he's also a determined fighter in the rebellion. And that Blarney doesn't really revolve around Mia and her brother, which is kind of the sense I was getting from Mia - that she's struggling to figure out her role in the revolution now and she's restless, as you say - just like Laras, but she's also young and young people, especially students (like meeeeee) think the world kind of revolves around them. So whilst public display of emotion would have been fine at Oxford, surrounded by students, they're not really viable now that the revolution has begun and she's at Blarney.

I don't know. I hope it wasn't awful.

[Quaddy]

Poor Laras. I feel like patting him on the head...except I know I would lose that hand...And I need my hands.

I think Mia gets it a little, which is why she's trying so hard (in her mind) to stick by his side and support him, but it seems to be the wrong thing to do so she is confused and hurt. Laras seems to expect her to be a soldier like him, which she desperately wants to be, but at the same time...she wants to do be DOING something. Her pleas for information aren't just because she wants to be at the center of the goings-on, it's genuinely because she needs to be doing something.

And this is probably going to be the genesis of their "almost" moment, where something happens to bring them back together: her as the fighter by his side and he as the one person she trusts to defend her back. When they start DOING things together again. Because neither of them are good at not doing things: she amuses herself by flirting and debating and fighting anyone stupid enough to challenge her, and he amuses himself by...thinking everyone is an idiot?

Since this is Laras' campfire, I think Mia might grow past it first. She will come to understand what it meant to him to admit as much as he had with regard to her, probably within the next couple of rounds. Which will also contribute to the almost healing of their relationship. Then, when the fight comes between Mia and Edward and she turns to him looking for help and support, he'll leave her to fight her own battles (knowing Laras, it'll be out of a genuine belief that she can handle herself, but Mia won't necessarily see it that way) and voila! We have meltdown.

You're right on the money that Mia is desperately looking for something, for a place within the rebellion for herself. Her whole life, she's been at the center of things just because of her last name, and now she's just another soldier. And actually, Mia is fine with that; she just desperately needs something to do. She needs orders, a mission, whatever. Even if it's just small moves (chess moves, as Laras says), she needs to DO something. So I don't necessarily think she believes the world revolves around her, but she would like some attention once in a while. Even just as a soldier in the war.

Your addition was absolutely amazing, darling. Laras is becoming more sympathetic than Mia at this point, and I think that's rather remarkable given that Laras is Laras...

We will need to relieve the tension eventually, of course, but not yet. Not until the end! MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

(Although I think it's absolutely appropriate for Mia to understand and accept that Laras will never be able to declare for her, as you say, just as Laras realizes he can.)

[Quaddy]

Also, did we ever discuss what brings about Edward and Mia's final fight? If not, I was thinking that perhaps Mia is injured somehow during one of their outings. This would frighten Edward and perhaps push him to demand she give it up. And it might provide an interesting moment for Laras, as to what his reaction would be. We know he freaked out (inwardly) when Mia was hurt during the infiltration, but would it affect how he reacts to Mia/Edward's fight at all?

[Matt]

Since this is Laras' campfire, I think Mia might grow past it first. She will come to understand what it meant to him to admit as much as he had with regard to her, probably within the next couple of rounds. Which will also contribute to the almost healing of their relationship. Then, when the fight comes between Mia and Edward and she turns to him looking for help and support, he'll leave her to fight her own battles (knowing Laras, it'll be out of a genuine belief that she can handle herself, but Mia won't necessarily see it that way) and voila! We have meltdown.

Actually I was thinking it might make more sense if she doesn't have ANY of those revelations until he's left for Russia.... In the sense that... I think it would make more sense if she somewhat refused to realise what he's getting at until later. Especially because even though we know what's going on, she doesn't. And it doesn't really fit with what we've been writing that she suddenly have a really quick revelation. Plus, I think because this is more Laras'y it makes sense that he might actually be that more sympathetic character for a bit. Of course, she'll come round. But it might be fun to have it come a little later, when she starts to realise that he's actually been trying and that part of the reason for his taking on the Russian contingent is because of her utter idiocy in sleeping with Colt Banner (that's his voice I swear haha) and her nonrecognition of his efforts. I don't think that she'd have the bust up with Laras if they started getting along so much better...

I don't know...

It might make sense that this moment helps them to repair something of what they had - maybe their joint time in Belfast releases some of their 'caged tiger' attitudes and makes them less volatile towards each other. But I think the deply rooted problems. Their miscommunication, her lack of awareness on how others perceive her at Blarney (she's used to English POV, this is Ireland and Ireland at war - they have no respect for royalty), his incomprehension of her own tension etc. That stays the same.

Then when she looks for him and he leaves her to it, that's a crisis because it reaffirms her concerns and it's partly because he's determined that he just needs to ween her from this apparent 'dependency'.

[Quaddy]

Sounds good to me. I've decided to have her go the rather more petulant route, actually. OK, maybe not petulant. But to kind of pull a Laras from the last campfire--to throw herself into training and pretend that she doesn't care when she really cares far too much, etc--and become rather self-destructive.

I do think Mia understands how people see her, though. Now that Laras has pointed it out, she will be on the lookout for it, and she will see it. That's just part of who she is. She desperately wants people to respect her, so if she is made to realize that she is not behaving in a manner deserving of respect, she will change her behavior. So that will change rather sooner than later.

The rest of it, though, the inability to see that he's trying, the fact that she made him leave by sleeping with Colt (though she'll realize that immediately after, of course), and that she hasn't really appreciated how much of himself he's been giving her...that will continue. In her mind, he is using her; in his, he's coming about as close to admitting his feelings for her as he possibly can. And so she decides (stupidly) that he doesn't care about her at all, when it's about as opposite of that as can be.

But I do believe going out on "missions" should ease their relationship a bit. After all, this will return them to what they were before: he will see the fighter he trained, and she will see the loyalty and devotion he has toward her (sort of...hard to put that). Does that make sense at all? So that when he leaves her to it, as you said, it hurts her all that much more.

Of course, Laras will actually have to be sympathetic in order to be the sympathetic one. And he'll have to realize that he made her in his image, so to be so disdainful of her when she behaves as she does when she's trapped is rather unfair. Because he is being somewhat unfair to her in that regard. He at least gets to know what's going on. She is both ignorant and (in her own mind) useless, and it's driving her nuts. And Laras, whom she believes would be the one person who would actually understand, is being an ass.

But that happens when they separate. They each realize they've fucked up.

[Quaddy]

Also, going through my notes...I told you that Laras and Charon are the only ones who know about Aiden's new American enclave in Miami, yes? We need to keep that in mind as it's how Mia, Tada, et al get into America. I should probably tell Ascetic this so he knows, too.

[Matt]

Would she even notice that he said it though? Caught up as she was in the belief that Laras is just jealous of Banner? Particularly as there are some people on her side anyway - you've already placed Max there.

I think he's getting there - Charon's keeping him calmer than Mia's really seeing because at least working in the Cell is keeping his crazy active intelligence a work out. But yeah, maybe he'll start realising that Mia doesn't have that to keep her brain working and that'll help him to realise why she thinks he's being such an ass. It might also be part of the realisation that leads him to go talk to her when he discovers her with Banner.

But... hmmm... fuck ups for sure.

[Quaddy]

She would. When you are as concerned what people think about you as Mia is, you notice. And it'll be the thing she fixates on, missing everything else Laras said/did (including very obviously attempting to reach out to her). I don't necessarily think she'll believe Laras straight away, but she will give him the benefit of the doubt. Honestly, it'll be Edward that fixes it for her. He needs some sympathetic vibes, too.

I can just see eventual readers screaming in frustration. We are being so mean to these poor people.

Now, and this is a logistics question...what exactly decides Charon on bringing Mia in on things? As it stands, she knows nothing at all--less than anyone except maybe her brother and Colt, and the American is doing it on purpose--and she'll have to be brought into the Circle (so to speak) in order to be part of the big mission later. Now, it could be that Laras was meant to be part of it and his leaving leaves Mia as the only fighter anyone trusts enough to be part of it...but I dunno...

[Matt]

I don't think he does chose to let her in anytime soon. Certainly not until Laras leaves. He might say something to Charon before he goes, telling him to put her in his place in his absence as you suggest - of course, not as a full leader, but as a representative of the British soldier or something. I think we'll have to give them military ranks you know.

But hmmm I think that should be when Laras has gone and maybe AFTER he's gone. As in like... maybe Charon doesn't immediately do as Laras says because he's annoyed with her/ maybe there's disagreement on the roundtable about whether to let her in. On the other hand, does she need to be in the circle to be involved in the big mission? Not really. Not until much later because that'll be the foot soldier position... I'd understand if you didn't want her to be left out like that though.

I did have a thought about something that could go down though. Everyone gets given a student number right? And so Shlomi and Tada would have been sent to Blarney because they were specialists - they were damn good at what they do as strategists/dissemblers etc. They'd be included from the beginning in Roundtables (not the small meetings nor with rights to the Cell but the big meetings yes). But Mia is essentially just a foot soldier right? She's good but her number would have been determined before she was trained and there are no other real fighters at Blarney. They're in various different places or dead (I think we should say there's somewhere where most of the soldiers were sent to stay in training etc). But maybe she got Blarney because she's a royal and Blarney is meant to be the strongest, the most safe, the most secure. Perhaps there could be a bust up between her and maybe Charon, after Laras leaves for Russia, when she's asking why she's still not being included and Charon appears to tell her that the only reason she's at Blarney is because she's blueblooded??? I think it could be a good twist. Making her that much more desperate to prove herself and sparking that little bit of craziness that gets her into the final showdown.

So maybe Laras does tell Charon to let her in on things - maybe it's in the next few rounds before he leaves, maybe he even tells her before going. But Charon says he's not sure of her. They have this fight about 'what the fuck am I even doing here then...' and then Charon's like 'well it was necessary at the time' but ummm yeah???

[Quaddy]

Actually, the only reason she's at Blarney is because Laras brought her with him and so she never learned about the significance of her student number. Laras, I guess subconsciously, wanted Mia with him at Blarney and brought her. But now that she knows about it, she can't leave...even to be sent to her rightful enclave (which, I suppose, should follow an almost Omegan Substation layout, in order to have soldiers all over the world). This is the real reason she's stuck underground--they not only don't know what to do with her, but she cannot leave or she'll become a safety concern.

So it's Laras' fault. (Mia's voice, I promise. I quite like Laras.)

I don't know how that changes things...except that it's not really Mia's fault she's stuck in this situation, so Laras might begin to feel slightly guilty that Mia is stuck underground as she was brought here because of his (in his mind) rather irrational...connection to Mia? I have no idea on that one.

I do know that Mia's role in the BIG MISSION is more than just foot soldier, as it is rather the...kind of Field General position. The one actually leading the charge into the building, so to speak. It's the role that Laras would have had if he'd gone, but since he decides to go to Russia, they need someone else. My thoughts were they actually go to Colt first, but he declines and tells them to go get Mia (in...less than polite language), as she's the one who's been "fucking him for so damn long, she's just Laras with a cunt" (that was Colt's voice in my head...) and would be better for it. So Mia, by virtue of being Laras...sort of second, I suppose, gets the role. Not that Charon is happy about it, but he does offer.

Now, the important thing to note about this mission is it is considered something of a suicide mission. Charon wanted Laras to go because Laras is probably one of the only people who could survive it, and Colt because, well, Colt is expendable. But Mia...Charon isn't sure she can survive and nor does he believe she is expendable. She is Royal, after all, and he is English. So maybe Charon and Mia definitely have a fight and Charon expresses worry about sending her and Mia is like "fuck it...I am going to prove myself in this damn war and I am going to prove myself to that fucking Russian" and convinces Charon she will go.

As to bringing her in on the Round Tables...you're right that she probably shouldn't. She should be quickly brought up to speed on the big mission (probably by Tada), but she definitely should stay out of the center of things. I do like the idea of Laras fighting to have her involved (without her knowing) as that definitely ups his sympathy factor; and, even on his way out, when he's beyond pissed, he tells Charon to give her something to do.

Now, to mention something, Mia's going to be keeping herself busy by teaching self-defense to a few of Edward's friends. Edward sets it up in order to make her happy enough to stay below ground and out of harm's way, though he also does it because she's so unhappy and because he's noticed opinions are wavering toward her. So she's safe, but she's also happy, and she feels like she's contributing and other people feel like she's contributing. Not a lot of people know she's been 'grounded', so to speak.

I say this as it'll contribute to the Laras/Mia dynamic, in that it'll show how poorly they communicate with one another. When she gets permission to set it up, Laras'll comment that she's ideal to teach people how to get hit. He'll think he's complimenting her (taking a hit is the most important part of learning how to fight, after all) and she'll think he's being disparaging toward her skills. And Laras will also never show up when she's giving lessons; in his mind, he's leaving her to it and respecting her space and breaking her of her neediness, but she'll think he believes it's beneath him (or something stupid). And it'll give you a chance to add even more sympathy for Laras, as the reader will be privy to how he's actually quite pleased for her, even if he doesn't tell anyone.

So...when Laras says to include her in the Round Tables/Big Attack, Charon is unsure...as Mia is doing good work with her classes, and because he's not sure he wants to sacrifice the Heir to the throne, and because he doesn't believe she's ready for this sort of thing, etc. I don't see Charon being the kind of yell at Mia she's only there because she's royal, as it wasn't her choice to go to Blarney and he is aware of this.

[Quaddy]

Or, you know, Laras could have felt she proved herself enough to come to Blarney instead of sending her to a farm...

[Quaddy]

Oh, and I'm with you on the military structuring. We do have to structure it differently than Omega, of course, which follows a standard military organizational structure.

So far, we have Enclaves, each with a Team Leader. These Enclaves are largely self-sufficient, and they interact within their own small sphere. Some of them (like Rio) are hack and espionage based; they steal information and plant false information, etc. and send their results on to the hubs. They cannot communicate directly with one another as they are afraid Omega will be able to find and hack into a worldwide Rebel network (which is...probably true, to a certain extent). In these enclaves, everyone is referred to by their skill set (Hacker, Spy, Soldier, Scientist, Dissembler, etc) except for the Team Lead (who is called Team Lead...or sir or hell just their name); the command structure is rather loose.

Each of these enclaves is represented by an information hub. These hubs are connected to places in which there is either no Rebel presence or no human presence at all. For example, Rio's hub is in an uninhabited part of Costa Rica. Belfast also has a hub, though that also has a small enclave; just a holding cell and a weigh station, mostly. No one really stays there for long. The Belfast hub was the information hub for Oxford, and is now the hub for Blarney.

Charon is Leader, I suppose, though we can come up with a better title for him. There was never meant to be a single person in charge of the rebellion, which is why Laras was sort of Shanghai'd into becoming Charon's partner in leadership. I guess the Conclave might be a good name for them, and the Cell is the heart of the Rebellion. Then there are the Round Tables, made up of the leaders of the various "types", for lack of a better term. There are the best Hackers, the best Spies, Dissemblers, Fighters (Laras), Scientists, etc all representing the whole. Unfortunately, because of the lack of an organized communications network, Blarney is really just a glorified information center. I mean, they're kind of like the tip of the pyramid; they can communicate with the European movements (in nations where a concerted effort has developed, like Ireland itself, France, Russia, etc) and organize large scale efforts in Europe at least.

Something Charon wants to push for, I suppose (and maybe Laras), is a world wide network. Helio (my Brazilian) wants to develop one as well, and between Denny, our American female, and my Miguel (a gifted hacker in his own right), they might be able to develop one that Omega wouldn't be able to hack. I admit I don't know enough about computers to know how this would work, but I suppose if they did it low tech enough, Omega wouldn't see it. Or they could mimic Omega code and thus go unnoticed by Omega officials...I dunno. Any ideas there?

Did...I cover everything? I never know...

[Matt]

I do know that Mia's role in the BIG MISSION is more than just foot soldier, as it is rather the...kind of Field General position. The one actually leading the charge into the building, so to speak. It's the role that Laras would have had if he'd gone, but since he decides to go to Russia, they need someone else. My thoughts were they actually go to Colt first, but he declines and tells them to go get Mia (in...less than polite language), as she's the one who's been "fucking him for so damn long, she's just Laras with a cunt" (that was Colt's voice in my head...) and would be better for it. So Mia, by virtue of being Laras...sort of second, I suppose, gets the role. Not that Charon is happy about it, but he does offer.

But Mia isn't the only other fighter apart from Laras at Blarney. We have our selection of Irish: including Paddy, another Sewer Rat in Caoilhfinn's crowd and there'd be at least two others because of the structure of their groups.

I do admit that she's worth more than a footsoldier and Laras would certainly want her to play a more vital role than just a dogsbody to be shot at. But I don't know if it's believable that a girl with a single years worth of training at most, and two missions to her name (albeit one that was pretty awesome), would be given such a high rank as a first command. It might make more sense if the Irish and/or Banner (although I don't think Banner would score points with Charon after actually confirming rumours) perhaps were bigger players - perhaps they all take on smaller squad groups - so she could be the head of one squad of people but then the others would also have squad. Paddy might be in charge because he's the most senior of the Irish soldier-types. She might then hold a 'second' role - like how the Irish have a 'leader' and then 'seconds'. That just seems more believable to me.

It would then make her growth to a more prominent leader more likely in Book III - if she's the head that leads 90% of her men to their deaths, is it really that viable that she'd be kept on in the same position? Or that she'd feel secure enough to hold that position? Not really - even if part of the failure is down to the lack of support from other 'allies' I'd say there would be blame and insecurity. As it is, being one of the very few survivors - and mainly thanks to some timely intervention on the part of her estranged lover - it might make more literary sense to have her build up to a more senior role - undertaking more of a 'second' role now and maybe even doing something at some point during that attack to distinguish herself rather than her being gratuitously given a senior position based on the word of a mentor-come-partner, some teaching (which is a very very good idea btw, I like it and it would explain why she might be given her own squad albeit I don't think it would make her an obvious mission leader) and a couple of missions.

I totally accept the idea that it's Laras' fault that she's in the enclave. Might that not also be a bit of a bitter reason for her being at Blarney? Like Tada has it figured out - maybe Zeph could have Tada even say something kind of gleefully about not being the only one of them meant to be there and she realises that her number doesn't actually correspond to his. Perhaps you're also right about Charon, but I can imagine a stressed out, disappointed Charon being rather more aggressive than we've thus far allowed him. I do think it might be a cool crisis for her to have - to have to wonder what she's even doing in Ireland - part of the build up and maybe it inspires her teaching etc. She feels the need to prove her right to be there.

The teaching is a great idea. And Laras would definitely respect it and want to let her get on with it. I think pretty much everything you said about his reactions would make sense - including the fact that it'll probably emphasise his empathetic side.

So...when Laras says to include her in the Round Tables/Big Attack, Charon is unsure...as Mia is doing good work with her classes, and because he's not sure he wants to sacrifice the Heir to the throne, and because he doesn't believe she's ready for this sort of thing, etc. I don't see Charon being the kind of yell at Mia she's only there because she's royal, as it wasn't her choice to go to Blarney and he is aware of this.

On the Round Tables - This sort of makes sense but I still think Charon might get angry at her because he might see her desire for inclusion to be overstepping. Even if Tada is included since he's supposed to be prodigy strategist.

That's the other thing though. Zeph - how do you see Tada fitting into the Round Tables? How does he fit into Blarney? Will he attend some of Mia's classes? Who is he going to interact with? I think we probably need to refer back to the List of Names on Page.1 of this board and figure out how that works too.

Something Charon wants to push for, I suppose (and maybe Laras), is a world wide network. Helio (my Brazilian) wants to develop one as well, and between Denny, our American female, and my Miguel (a gifted hacker in his own right), they might be able to develop one that Omega wouldn't be able to hack. I admit I don't know enough about computers to know how this would work, but I suppose if they did it low tech enough, Omega wouldn't see it. Or they could mimic Omega code and thus go unnoticed by Omega officials...I dunno. Any ideas there?

WWN would be useful and yes we probably have the resources, especially once you add in the French Systems.

Perhaps we roll this desire for a WWN into the ally-tensions between Russian etc and the Food vs Freedom scale (Page 13 or 15 on the forum) I'm going to keep musing over this but not quite sure yet. I'll have a cup of tea and think harder.

[Zephyr Shenkiken]

it took both of my breaks at work to catch up on this lol.

As far as Tada goes he'd probably be somewhat reluctant to take on an important spot so soon actually. Basically he'd be rolling from one big mission, to the destruction of Oxford, surviving and escaping capture, and then right into planning another big mission. Part of his struggle is that his smarts and prodigiousness(is that a word?) outweight his experience.

His interactions will likely be with Mia since she's one of the only survivors there whom he's familiar with and can openly talk to. I can see them both being too distracted by their own inner struggles to really help one another.

If Tada is placed on the round table he'd likely do it out of sense of duty, but he's likely to be overwhelmed at some point. He'll have to have someone to turn to I'm just not sure who it would be. I guess it would likely be whoever brings him on in the first place. I mean with Ortrun dead he's got very few options in vouchers. I mean he has that mission he orchestrated under his belt but that didn't exactly soar with flying colors.

[Quaddy]

More fighters...but most of them are "higher-ups" right? The kind like Laras who are too busy being leaders to go out and fight. 'Cause Blarney is, as I said, more of an information bunker. Too many missions coming out of Blarney would ruin the secrecy. So...I guess what I meant to say is Mia and Colt are the only fighters who actually have TIME to fight. Who aren't part of leadership and thus distracted by leadery things.

If this is the case, I agree totally that Mia should be put in charge of a squad. Maybe Charon is initially reluctant to even let her go because of her inexperience, but...maybe even a couple of her students step up in her defense? I know Max at the very least will become one of her students, and he's the one who ends up infiltrating Prime at the end of the mission. So he's pretty high up there for someone so young (maybe...25). So she ends up getting to prove herself by leading a squad. Pretty much everyone dies--Mia is one of a handful of survivors and that because Laras came to rescue her. Either way, she's going to feel awful, but I think we can have Laras be nice enough to support her in that moment. That she isn't to blame. That's later, of course. And having so many people dead leaves Charon with no choice but to move her up the ranks faster than she otherwise would have been.

I'm glad you're cool with Laras being the reason she's there, 'cause, like I said, it really gives us an opportunity to play with their relationship. Because he wanted her there, either because he lurves her (I know, I know...) or because he respects her enough to have brought her with him, and then she ended up turfed. And finding out either from Charon or even from Tada (or both, actually; I could see a distraught Mia going to Charon after speaking to Tada and Charon snapping at her) that she wasn't even meant to be there...it'll cause her to throw herself into her teaching even more so than before.

'Cause I have that part written. The part where Edward gets his friends to ask her to teach them. It'll start out small, but I think it should grow and, as it grows, Mia begins earning some respect from her peers and she feels like she's sort of proven herself that she belongs there even if she wasn't supposed to be there in the first place. And then when she goes to Charon, he yells that she is over-stepping her bounds, etc. He apologizes for snapping, of course, but Mia basically goes and locks herself in the gym and focuses on teaching until she's put in charge of a squad for Big Attack and throws herself into it in its entirety.

Is it after the next round that we start going out on smaller missions? Because we want, what, two-four more rounds before Milarasgate '13? Something like that. This story is getting complicated....and I love it. So, as far as Mia is concerned, we've got lessons, finding out she wasn't meant to be there, going out on smaller missions (perhaps Charon didn't even want to send her on those but Laras insisted on it...and this is something Mia isn't made aware of until later), and proving that she belongs there/making friends. When she is injured during a smaller mission, Edward freaks out and insists she never does it again and only teaches and stuff (effectively forcing her to choose between Laras/war and Edward/not war) and she tells him to shove off (causing him to leave Blarney on a long mission with his team) and then Laras is Laras and she sleeps with Colt and bleck.

Dear God, is there actually a war going on there somewhere? There is, right?

Um...we need to write more Omega stuff. Like Omega taking on Rebels/sympathizers and defeating them, and the crumbling of the rebellion to the point that Blarney becomes one of the only strongholds left. And that Russia ultimately decides not to be part of the main rebellion (which we decided on, right?). And stuff.

As for Tada, I imagine Mia is going to need him. A friend, you know, who understands how much she loves the rebellion and doesn't think she needs to prove herself, etc. I imagine he'll confess to her about his brain and then he'll try to be a voice of reason vis a vis Laras and Mia's role in the Rebellion. And if he joins the Inner Circle, he'll be a reason for Mia to be really fucking angry at Charon (given that he's been a part of the rebellion as long as she has and lacks experience just as much as she does, and being specially gifted is no excuse given that she worked her ass off to be as good as she is, etc) and her situation.

As far as the WWN, I could definitely see Russia not being a fan of that. Perhaps Charon's decision to build one contributes to Russia's decision to separate from the formal rebellion?

Have I mentioned how much I love planning for this story?

[Zephyr Shenkiken]

Yes Professor you have.

It's getting interesting. Oh and anyway I meant to ask if you wanted me to just end it at him getting to Blarney or does he need to come in and talk to people or something?

Also, I do need some help with forming up the rest of Tada's story. If I keep going at his side story thing by myself he's going to end up isolated again. Him telling Mia would be a good start, though that'd have to be a rather long conversation in general for him to open up with something like that. Granted there's no one else he trusts to tell.

Also though, wouldn't it make more sense for Mia to get a higher rank for a successful mission? I mean we don't want critical readers to think this story's rebels are a bunch of monkeys fuckin' a football (I really wanted to use that one). Are we really not going to have any real successes till the end? I mean their infiltration got their base nuked already. That's a pretty big feux pas. I just think they need some moments to actually shine and warrent the regard they end up recieving.

That's just what I'm seeing right now. I'm sure you have your reasons for wanting to push the drama with losses though.

Oh, also did you want me to do anything specific with Nick Fury or my other side folks?

[Quaddy]

Yeah!

I answered in the other forum, but to reiterate: you can just get there if you want. I'm ending my next addition (so far...I haven't gotten to that part yet, as I am still in the planning stage) with everyone greeting Tada and him being awkward and telling Mia he needs a minute alone with her. So you could actually write all the way up to the point that Mia gets there to say hello to him; maybe Charon greets him and tells him he'll need to report to the Round Table the next day, or something. Charon's gotten a little tense lately.

I see Mia relying on Tada a lot in the coming days, especially after shit blows up with Laras and her brother. I mean, if you feel they're being unfair to Mia, perhaps Tada feels the same and actually tells her stuff? I don't know about that, though, as he is a particularly professional individual when he needs to be. I see it being pretty cool that Mia knows about Tada's "issues" but no one else does, and yet she knows nothing about the war; it would make her feel better, at least.

The point of Mia not getting a higher rank is, I believe, because of her lack of experience. But if Tada gets one, it largely just becomes unfair. I'm writing for Max this round and the excuse becomes that her skills are redundant as they have the man who trained her sitting right on the other side of the table (namely Laras) whereas Tada's skills are very much needed there. And that it might be unfair, but war isn't fair, etc. And she wasn't meant to be there in the first place, and they can't just treat her special because she's a Princess and whatnot. I think everyone is very...sensitive to not treating her special because of her blood; on one hand, Charon wants to think of everyone as soldiers in an army, but on the other...he is English and she *is* the Heir to his throne, so perhaps there's a little reticence there to get her involved too much.

It's really complicated.

And anyway, there are small victories throughout this campfire. Edward's group is eventually going to be sent to France to start their own enclave doing what they do (Charon wants to get them out of Blarney in order to keep Blarney safe) and they are quite successful at what they do (mainly feeding and taking care of people affected by the Rebellion). For the next few rounds, at least, until Laras leaves in a hissy fit (Mia's voice, I swear, Matt), there are going to be small scale victories. Basically, Laras will prevail and say they need to make small moves, but the Conclave still decides they need to plan something big. Let it be said Laras thinks this is dumb (he said so himself), and he's right.

Laras needs to stop being right all the time. Good thing he's being a general jerkface or else people would like him too much.

But yeah, overall...the Rebellion is largely unprepared. It's like Star Wars, man. Death Star...blowing up planets...Darth Vader...the Rebellion needs something big. Right now they are unprepared and overwhelmed and they don't even have a means of communicating with one another. No one expected Oxford to get blown so soon, and they were thrown off balance by the purging of America. So they're struggling to catch up and get their feet under them, but that's difficult as the Rebellion isn't a singular unit. It's a bunch of small enclaves that are sometimes united into movements (the Russians, the Yeatsians, etc) but do not act together. Which is why Charon wants to unite them so much with a network.

I think we're all agreed Mia will end up with a higher rank. But I think not giving her one and giving Tada one will highlight some concerns within the Rebellion and their general conservatism. Plus, Matt has a point: Mia hasn't done anything yet to prove she deserves one. What happened at Oxford was one thing, but this is war. Yes, she shanghai'd a bunch of students into fighting back (and going to the professors), she killed Templeton and Stephens and carried Laras on her back out of the rubble to Glebe House (effectively saving his life...), but you know...she's not bitter or anything. (Stabbing pains behind my eye...ow.) But that was all at Oxford and, in the case of Glebe House, not necessarily common knowledge.

Yes, I agree they're being unfair to her. Not even as Mia's writer, but as someone who reads this thing, I agree they're being unfair. But it's war, it's not about being fair. And she'll get there. It's even worse for her, though, because she's the Princess and, to a certain extent, being a Princess is what is holding her back right now. Whether out of concern for seeming to favor her or out of fear of her demise, it happens. By the end of Rebel, half of leadership will be dead, leaving Charon no choice but to bring her in. Until then, we get to watch Mia squirm.

And I'm ranting...

As far as Nick Fury, I think he should move out and begin a very thorough search for the 'rebel scum' (I really wanted to throw a Star Wars line in there) that is very clearly hiding and tinkering with his asset (namely Tada). It needs to be brutal and it needs to be deadly, and it needs to kill as many innocents as possible. But it also needs to be effective. Not necessarily in finding Tada, but in breaking the spirits of the people and in weakening the already terribly weak structure of the Rebellion.

Also, people...named characters...need to die before the end of this. One or two of the fighters, maybe even one of Edward's group, etc. Not Max, though...we need him. I was thinking, too, that if we can't get Ascetic to stay a part of this, we kill off Charon and make Heliodoro the head of the Rebellion. He's going to be the other major factor in a WWN (he's going to start developing one even before Blarney, I think...or at least one to unite the Western Hemisphere) and I think would be a viable backup system. But people do need to die. On missions. 'Cause this is war. We're isolating and insulating our Blarney characters, but even they are vulnerable.

Basically, we need to GRR Martin this shit.

Also, Boston right now...is being terrorized by a 19-year-old Russian. Whose name is pronounced 'jokar'. It's a Batman movie, and I personally hope they string his as up by his toes and go full on Ramsay Bolton on his ass (any Game of Thrones readers here?). Blow up the Boston Marathon, will you? I *knew* it wasn't an Islamic group. Chechnyans, I believe, who "found Islam". You know...it only took the FBI four days to solve this one! Well done, FBI!

Also, factoid of the day: Wanted posters? Invented by Allan Pinkerton.

[Matt]

More fighters...but most of them are "higher-ups" right? The kind like Laras who are too busy being leaders to go out and fight. 'Cause Blarney is, as I said, more of an information bunker. Too many missions coming out of Blarney would ruin the secrecy. So...I guess what I meant to say is Mia and Colt are the only fighters who actually have TIME to fight. Who aren't part of leadership and thus distracted by leadery things.

If this is the case, I agree totally that Mia should be put in charge of a squad. Maybe Charon is initially reluctant to even let her go because of her inexperience, but...maybe even a couple of her students step up in her defense?

I wouldn't say they're too busy or important to actually fight - no. That wouldn't really make any sense. They're involved in the same way that field marshalls are involved when it comes to the Round Tables. But there's not really enough high-ranking, experienced soldiers for them not ALSO be involved in direct combat. Plus most of them wouldn't want to be excluded from that kind of action. That's their job. That's what they're there to do. And there's a reason why strategists are distinct from the soldiers and why Tada would be included despite the fact that their history is sort of the same.

Admittedly, yes, too many out of Blarney and you've got an issue but I think it might be good to maybe have our friend the fisherman stay sort of involved - like it can come out in the next round that he's willing to transport people back and forth between Ireland and England. That way things can happen in England as 'distractions to make it look like Oxford wasn't destroyed at all. Plus I'm thinking that as next round Denny's going to have a bigger role from my side, I'm probably going to have some more of the tech side show through and probably have some 'emails' sent around that'd include info on what other enclaves are doing.

On Charon - I think seeing him frazzle would be good, he's very calm and collected atm but I think it would be good to make him more human.

I'd actually quite like to develop his relationship with Laras. I think they'd be good for each other.

As far as the WWN, I could definitely see Russia not being a fan of that. Perhaps Charon's decision to build one contributes to Russia's decision to separate from the formal rebellion?

I think they're more likely to disagree with the methods than the idea of a WWN. They're more inclined to terrorist-type violence. They see those who are pro-Food as the enemy as much as the actual government. I think that's something I'm going to play with with my Miguel and Lev. They're becoming very good friends, but the Russians generally see Miguel as inferior and untrustworthy (and expendable) because of his non-Gaian blood.

Dear God, is there actually a war going on there somewhere? There is, right?

It's more of a Cold War right now isn't it? Or terror-war? It's not like Afghan or a real warzone atm. I'm kind of seeing it more like IRA/guerilla warfare currently but then in the next few rounds developing a bit more and a bit more and into a real war. Only Omega can't really bomb loads of places atm. And most of our guys wouldn't attack civilian areas. That's the sort of thing the Russians might do.

You really need to read Restless haha.

Let it be said Laras thinks this is dumb (he said so himself), and he's right. Laras needs to stop being right all the time. Good thing he's being a general jerkface or else people would like him too much.

I hope you don't mind that he's right here. He has, at every turn, been reticent about big displays if you look back at Renegade. So I was just working in keeping with that. He wants to be involved, to be busy and to be part of the action. But he's calculated and if you think of how he was in Renegade, he never really wanted to make any of the bold moves. Hence his fury when the newspaper screwed up.

I think we're all agreed Mia will end up with a higher rank. But I think not giving her one and giving Tada one will highlight some concerns within the Rebellion and their general conservatism. Plus, Matt has a point: Mia hasn't done anything yet to prove she deserves one. What happened at Oxford was one thing, but this is war. Yes, she shanghai'd a bunch of students into fighting back (and going to the professors), she killed Templeton and Stephens and carried Laras on her back out of the rubble to Glebe House (effectively saving his life...), but you know...she's not bitter or anything. (Stabbing pains behind my eye...ow.) But that was all at Oxford and, in the case of Glebe House, not necessarily common knowledge.

Yes, I agree they're being unfair to her. Not even as Mia's writer, but as someone who reads this thing, I agree they're being unfair. But it's war, it's not about being fair. And she'll get there. It's even worse for her, though, because she's the Princess and, to a certain extent, being a Princess is what is holding her back right now. Whether out of concern for seeming to favor her or out of fear of her demise, it happens. By the end of Rebel, half of leadership will be dead, leaving Charon no choice but to bring her in. Until then, we get to watch Mia squirm.

She will end up with a higher rank. I think she needs to scrape and crawl to earn it though. And that's partly me and partly Laras and partly Charon and partly the sense I get from the situation. I'm glad you agree that she hasn't really done enough to be put up there already - I really do think she has to prove herself for everyone. And yeah, sure she persuaded Laras and Charon to band together with Tada etc to go rescue Phelps - but at the same time that move was the trigger fro the bombing of Oxford (or at least it looks that way to a lot of outsiders), and then sure she killed Templeton and Stephans, but then she was the one that had to be carried home and was comatose afterwards and a lot of people will have just seen the jointed efforts of the team - not her role. Glebe House - again, awesome move, but it's also intensely private. Do we think that they would have chatted about it to people? Not really. She can always bring it up if you want, but it's something Laras will have acknowledged and appreciated and maybe he'll bring it up when he's talking to Charon about Mia. He might even use it to show that she's a different kind of soldier. But most of this stuff is stuff ONLY LARAS HAS SEEN. So 'not necessarily common knowledge' is a good way to put it. And it's also the reason why Laras has more faith in her than others, why he's unnerved by her neediness, why he'll first suggest then fight to have her given more responsibility outside of the Round Tables.

I don't really think they're being unfair to her though. I think it might seem it to her. But it's war, as you say, and they have to be ruthless, they have to demand more of the people involved, they have to know that they can trust each other and really she's so young, relatively inexperienced and she's not been comporting herself well at Blarney, so trust will need to be won (which is what her teaching will really do for her). By the end though. That's cool.

Also can we raincheck on Charon dying? I really like him.

[Quaddy]

Gotcha. They'll be the ones involved in the missions, then. Perhaps Laras insists she be allowed to go with them? He has a conversation with Charon, maybe even brings up the bit with Glebe House, etc and convinces Charon to let her go. But Laras is in charge of her, and should anything happen, it would be on Laras (in more of a 'if Mia fucks this up' way than 'if something happens TO her' way, of course). So it's kind of a probationary period, so to speak?

I feel kinda bad we're planning all this shit for Charon without Ascetic. I sent him an e-mail, but he's on so rarely, I feel like we're going to have to take over for him, as well. I'm hesitant to write from his POV because, well, I honestly think I'm too American to do it right (he's so damn English...), and because Ascetic is still technically a part of this thing. Oi vey.

But yeah, cultivate a relationship there. I like that idea. Laras needs someone to fill that sort of Phelps role and as Phelps will never be the same, and I'm not sure their relationship will ever be what it was (Erik is working on that, btdubs, but still...), Phelps might not fill it anymore. We can't have Laras pounding on the piano and drinking tons of alcohol.

I plan on going with your idea of Mia turning to Charon as he's the calm one and him basically screaming at her that she's not worthy of it yet. Mia will whine for a bit, but she's going to be even MORE determined to prove his ass wrong. She's obnoxious like that. Sometimes I wonder if I wouldn't like Laras more and then I remember I wouldn't...

Team Max, y'all!

Also, I meant to say this earlier in this post, but I definitely agree about the fisherman. I legit like that idea 'cause it means this is a character we didn't just introduce and get rid of. We need to do the same with the Priest from Glebe House, Joshua. I think perhaps he might be involved in the Mission to America somehow.

The Russians suck. Seriously. No wonder Laras is such a fucked up man. Also, still man-hunting as far as I know. I mean, this is kind of perfect...a couple of Russians setting off a bomb at the Boston Marathon in pro-Chechnya Islamist solidarity. Very much in fitting with this story only, you know, real...and infuriating. And I feel no pity for what will happen to him when he's found. Just saying.

(Americans don't respond well to attacks...)

I am going to the bookstore tomorrow to purchase it. For serious. I've hit my book budget for the month, but who cares. I'm buying it. And yes, the IRA allusion works perfectly for what we've got right now. We're...to bring it back even earlier...we're at the Easter Rising portion of our Anglo-Irish conflict, the reaction to which (namely...Oxford) will eventually led to full on warfare. Now I really want to bring the Fenians in...can we name one of our little Irish groups the Fenians?

Let Laras be right. He's a smart man and he knows what he is doing. And big moves mean big counterattacks from the enemy. Working small, chipping away from Omega in a way that doesn't tip the Rebellion's hand...that's the way to go. Which is why BIG MISSION ends up failing miserably. Actually...it might have worked better if Shlomi and Cyril didn't get caught by Ether, murdered cruelly, and have Ether tip off Omega that something might be up...

Oh Shlomi...you will have such a tragic story...

Should I be writing more bad behavior? What exactly does everyone at Blarney think she's been doing? Most of the time, she's been in the gym...doing nothing, as she has had nothing to do. I guess people see that as being useless. And then there's the public fights with her brother, but those were meant to be quiet discussions, really...Mia's just loud. Yeah, teaching will help a lot.

Technically, if the excuse is she hasn't proven herself, Tada hasn't proven himself, either. His one mission ended with Oxford getting blown up. By that logic, he doesn't deserve a place on the Round Tables. But because he was born with a special brain, he gets an automatic in, and Mia is left to prove herself to everyone. Yeah, she is definitely going to see that as unfair. I think a lot of people would. Max does. But we've already decided he's one of her more outspoken allies (admittedly because he had a crush on her growing up).

Laras is just so adorable in my head right now. He's trying so hard and anyone with half a brain should be able to see how he has definite feelings for Mia...but Mia is being so self-absorbed even I'm angry at her. I think that's probably why I want things to change so quickly...I'm tired of writing for a character who's being an idiot.

Yes, we can rain check. I was just suggesting this as a last resort should it come to that.

[Quaddy]

OK, so...to get this discussion out of the Discussion page...

I was re-reading a bit of what we've already written and there's a theme we need to address. Symbolism. The Symbolism of people like Edward and Mia being willing to take up arms against Deklahn. A certain 'rally around the flag' effect, or even...cult of personality. I have no idea what I'm saying here. I'm a historian. People like Abraham Lincoln and William Wallace, you know...symbols.

I know the people in Blarney are basically of the mindset of 'fuck symbolism', but there is a certain logic to the notion. Does this ever come into effect? Maybe in the third story? After she proves herself to the Rebellion itself?

I have no idea...I'm quite tired and have been thinking about this too much.

[Matt]

People only become symbols through stories. Oddly enough we've already touched on symbolism with Laras and the Russians - people know him, they know his father. There are stories about them. Not that Laras is a cult of personality figure of any kind but rebels know of him, and more people would know of his father because of the terrorist type actions he's taken as the storm.

I wouldn't have thought Edward had much symbolism behind him - I imagine a lot of people don't even realise that he's alive.

That's part of the reason why I think we need to have missions in and around England - so that people realise that the bomboing of Oxford did little more than interrupt a chain of events.

But symbolism, something purely figurative, is also intrinsically literary. It comes through language, communication and storytelling. It's why people like Lincoln or Kennedy or Stalin or Caesar or Byron have 'cult of personalities' - people tell stories, they become heroes or villains. Like in the Cold War. With McCarthyism. Or the creation of Thatcherites.

So does it ever come into effect with Mia? Only if she becomes a public figure. Much more so than just a potentially-dead, ex-royal.

It could be interesting to play with the idea that the royal family becomes an actual figurehead.